Whoops - Part II

[Mark Hofman]

Looking for wisdom (comfort, reassurance, intellect,....)



The insurance adjustor came by the house today to give me an estimate on repairing my boat. He says that a quality shop can cut out the damaged part of the top cap (gunwale), which on my boat is one long, oval-rectangular piece of aluminum rivited to the side walls of the hull, and weld in a replacement piece. Then repaint and install a new rub rail.



For those of you who know about metals and boats and welding, here's are my questions:



Do I accept this repair technique as being valid? What chance is there that a repair like this will compromise the integrity of the boat? Or...



Do I make it clear that I want the entire top cap replaced from bow to stern? Or...



Do I just live with the damage (which doesn't compromise the integrity of the hull right now) and pocket the insurance check as compensation for decreased value?



What would you do in my shoes? Here are a couple of pictures. They show the indentation horizontally, but don't show that there is some vertical distortion of the piece.

 

[Marty Klein]

I've watched enough of those auto rebuild shows to know that what you're talking can be done and done quite well. Key will be finding the quality shop that can do the work to a high standard of quality. Those giant photos you posted make it hard to determine the actual size of the damage. Can it cleanly hold the rub rail as is? If so, I don't know if I would even get the repairs done. It even appears that the offending dents could be pushed out a little bit. I don't think the repair as envisioned would affect the integrity of the hull cap at all.

 

[Scott Hammer TOXIC]

Hmmmmm....Tough call. You are going to have to get some kind of repair so that your rub rail will hold. I would take it to a good aluminum shop on my own and see what they say. Also get a cost from them. You probably have options as to what degree you can have it fixed. For example, when I got t-boned in my jeep, there was some "wrinkling" of the sheet metal under my door but as those who have a jeep know, they are not smooth finish vehicles, the sides are covered with spot weld marks etc., it's just the way jeeps are. I choose not to have the shop fix the wrinkle and take the $$ and apply it to a new windshield frame that was rusted instead. Fixing the wrikle would have involved pulling the fender, fixing the wrinkle, repainting, re-doing the pinstripe and a new JEEP decal. That more than coverd the frame with a little $$ in my pocket!! I wanted the new frame more cause my shoes were getting wet when it rained!!:lol::lol: You might be able to do something similar.



TOXIC

 

[TOMMY RICH]

I say put the $ in your pocket and keep on truckin'.

 

[Kim Becker]

For the sake of appearence only you can fill that in with liquid aluminum and then sand and form it to match. If done properly you will have a tough time seeing it was ever there. You can purchase aluminum in tubs like a paste or tubes like tooth paste and even those pre mixed tubes where you cut some, roll it in your hand till the color looks uniform and put it in place like body putty. The stuff really works well. i have used this stuff many times in the past for all kinds of repairs.

 

[Tim Koepp]

I'd be hesitant to cut out a piece and replace. On a car, body work is typically NOT subjected to the "load" and "torque" a boat hull is.. the car or truck would have fenders and panels attached TO it. the boat, the hull IS the frame.



If your damage is truly cosmetic in nature, I'd pocket the check and buy a new reel.

 

[Scott Hammer TOXIC]

Hey MO, just noticed your name is on yer boat in the first pic!!:lol::lol:



TOXIC

 

[Greg Meyer]

Mo,



Look up Jeff White (Magna 19) here in the member list. Nobody knows "metal" better than he does. Get his opinion via email.



I would give his advice serious thought.

 

[Dan J.]

If it were me; I'd get at least two (preferably three) of your own estimates from quality fab shops specializing in marine hulls. Take the two (highest) and average the totals. Add 10% minimum for diminished value in that area that will be warranty void. (Unless you choose a Tracker repair facility and have time to spare waiting. ) Settle for no less, with your estimates as proof if necessary. Don't forget any incidentals. (Like your torn cover, a detailing to remove repair debris, wheel rubs from the accident, decal replacement and installation, etc.) Do not let them make the check payable to anyone except you, the insured. Many adjusters will try to make it to the repair facility and you. The body shop hasn't made any of your boat or insurance payments, have they? :blink:



All I see is a cosmetic dent that I'd just file, sand, rub out and touch up. If you're comfortable with a doll and hammer, you could do some minor reshaping. (Use a hot lamp or a heat gun for greater results.) FWIW - Any cutting or resectioning of the cap rail will most likely weaken this area unless properly reinforced upon repair and entailing a lot more labor; particularly if it is to be unseen upon completion. (Most all of a full estimate for this will be labor!) - If the rubrail won't cooperate after the best driveway mending, I'd zip a 1/8" hole through rubrail and hull and sink an RTV'd SS screw and black fiber recessed washer, if absolutely necessary. You should be able to readjust by hand with simple tools the rubrail track from the pic views shown.



You deserve the fullest compensation for all of your damages. They are getting off very lightly, for the actions of their insured could have been brutally worse. Hopefully, this will create enough of a ding in the offenders record to remind him to drive safely!

 

[Marty Klein]

I know some dolls, but I don't know that I'd arm them with a hammer. :wacko:

 

[Mark Hofman]

Since I don't know what a 'doll' is (well, I DO know what a doll is; I married one) when it concerns metal work, I can definitely say I'm not comfortable using one.



The dent is significant enough that it will NOT hold the rub rail in place. After the accident, I just pulled the broken rub rail pieces completely out of the channel. Part of me just wants to pull the rub rail out of the other side as well and be done with it; file down the metal spurs from the impact and call it 'battle damage.' After all, it's an aluminum boat, it's already got real battle scars (from trees, rocks, docks, and my shoes), the dent as it is hasn't compromised the strength of the hull, and I don't plan on selling the boat any time soon.



So why do I need a rub rail?

 

[TOMMY RICH]

You don't...I have some pretty good dents in mine from the HARD PVC bumpers they use at Dale Hollow now

One I just noticed last nite...I seen the rub mark but, after I looked at it in the shadows...it's a dent.

 

[JEFF WHITE]

if the top cap is riveted on and is 1 piece,i would make them replace the whole top cap.i don't think any amount of welding or back bracing would make it as strong as the original piece,plus the top cap keeps the sides from flexing,and with this cut out,and a new piece welded in place,it wouldn't look right,and the strength of the parent metal at the weld would be compromised to the point it would eventually break or crack at the weld(s) at some point in time down the road.



if you go the other route as to leave it as is and pocket the $$$,might be a good idea,but it looks like the top of the cap has a small bulge in it,so the aluminum has been stretched at this point,with the flexing the aluminum does,ever so slightly eventually it will break.also did it push in on the rail,cant really tell in the picture,if it did it already stretched the metal a little bit and bowed the side in a little.if you can stand not having your boat for 3-4 months send it back to tracker,let them do an analysis on the dent and let them either fix it or do whatever you need to after you get there findings back.also a good marine surveyor will do the same,but will cost a little $$$ to do it,but his opinion is another one to give the insurance company.



opinions are like a##holes,everyones got one!! do what makes you happy!

 

[Dan J.]

A "doll" or "dolly" is a small hand anvil with curved and/or bevelled edges for metal working. Usually used with an iron flat or ball ping hammer (rough work), rawhide or rubber for finer work. I've had moderate success on my own in the past, but not worth the time and effort for the result to look pretty. (It's a must with a bush hog. You will hit rocks, stumps, etc. and have to bang out decks, blades, etc. A handy small addition to the tractor box. LOL!) A good metal body man will return the surface like you bought it. It just won't be cheap.



You could re-rail it yourself. Several styles and widths are available to dang near hide the bang as it sets! Just about any big marine retailer will have some variety at X per ft. Pull off the old, slap on the new. You'll eventually do this if you keep the boat for it's lifespan, I would bet.



Without nary a second look, you could easily remove it, touch it up, and go Tarzan; sans a belt!! :lol::lol::lol:

 

[Marty Klein]

A doll is a tool that goes on the backside of the metal you are trying to re-shape. It comes in various shapes depending on what you want the metal to do [might be flat, round, etc]. Hit the metal with the right hammer and the doll causes the metal to do this or that.

 

[Dan J.]

Jeff posted while I was thumbing away at my response. He is dead on. Definitely a reason to consider pushing the snowball to far down the hill.

 

[Mark Hofman]

Thanks for all the input. I did talk to a local Tracker dealer who ships boats needing repair to a place across the river (I live in St. Louis) rather than all the way back to Springfield. They are confident that shop can make the necessary repairs.



I may ask for the name of that company and take the boat over there myself to have them assess the damage, and discuss how I would want it repaired. If I can't get the answer I'd like, then I'll probably call the Springfield repair center and have the same conversation with them. My insurance company adjustor said they would work with whatever repair center I chose, and would file a supplemental claim if the repair requires more than cutting out the damaged section and welding in a new one. He did say that they may have to replace the entire top cap, so the adjustor even agrees that it should be fixed right, not cheap.



Magna, it didn't deform the rail. The inside curve of the rail is not affected. The big damage is that the rub rail tabs in the metal are crushed and deformed, there is a dent in the outside edge of 1/4 to 1/3 of an inch, and the outside edge is bulged up about 1/8 to 1/4 inch going back a 1/4 to 1/3 of the width of the rail. The paint isn't even cracked. I've gotta admit - that top cap is a pretty strong piece of metal. Also, there is no deformation of the sidewall of the hull, or of the aluminum around the rivets just below where the damage occurred.