Federation vs BASS and 'stuff'

[Texas Transplant]

Been watching all the back and forth between BASS and the Federation Rep's the past several weeks. I went to a district meeting about 2 weeks ago, and got some of the low down there.



For me, I'm not all that enamored with our SC Federation, it's offiers, or what they shove down our throats. Now I don't have all the history with the Federation Rep's, but I know this. If it's like any of the other 'public non-profit' type groups I've been associated with, the general rule is . . . .



He who has the power, runs the show and doesn't want to give up the power. That's the attitude that we get from the SC Federation all the time.



An extra $5.00 in BASS dues for federation members, is far less than one good crankbait. It's been years since they asked for an increase.



I'm also not sure about the Federation Rep's getting canned (membership revoked) either.



I guess I'm going to side with Ray Scott on this one (re: Bassfan today). Blame/guilty parties on both sides. I wish they would turn over the whole Federation thing to Ray and let him run with it (not that he would take it). Maybe it's just wishfull thinking.



Tex

 

[Bill McElroy]

IMO Here's what will happen....Look for a MAJOR migration of Federation members to switch over to Irwin's camp....I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they start up a new "Operation Bass" type group. (and SOON) Afterall...all they really need to do is offer tournament insurance to it's members and they'd have all the reason they'd need to join!! And with Irwin's marketing prowess...he could probably lure a major insurance company into sponsoring the BFL, FLW and all their members.



I've said it before...right now,..BASS/ESPN is Irwin's BEST customer!!...:blink::lol:

 

[Jim B]

Tex,

This whole issue goes way further then $5 per person. The real root of the problem is ESPN/BASS and thier inability to realise they do not nor never will own the federation. All the state federations are thier own companies each with thier own rules and regulations seprate from BASS. The Bass Federation( company) was put in place by all the state federations to have a unified voice. The 6 divisional reps were put in place by the states so that BASS would only have to deal with 6 people instead of over 50. BASS cant dismiss those people of thier roles because BASS did not put them in place nor can they.



They are trying to mandate a dues increase but not accounting for the why of the increase. I dont know how long you have been in the SC federation but members of my club remember when the dues was first put in place about 15 years ago. Back then BASS wanted the dues to fund the championship payouts and enviornmental events and insurance. There was a breakdown given of where all that money was to be spent and all the states voted on it. When they raised it from $12 to $15 to find casting kids and other youth stuff they did the same thing. I remember bringing it to my club to vote on and voting on it at my local Federation meeting. This time around they are just wanting 5 more dollars and not telling anyone why. If they are going to claim its "justified" then at least give some supporting facts.



When it comes to that money there are other issues. that $15 for federation dues are written into many clubs and state federation bylaws as BASS's wish. I know in my club the october is the time to change bylaws, its still written in ours that the federation dues are $15. We cant just go ask for another $5 per member until that bylaw is changed.



Like it or not the culture of BASS has changed since ESPN took over. It is no longer about growing the sport or protecting the resource or getting kids involved etc. All the things that it stood for back when i joined many years ago. Now its all about the bottom line and makine as much profit as possible and they prove it over and over again when they make moves like this or try to take away our ability to have or own state sponsors etc. Ray Scott isnt going to save this situation either. BASS uses Ray like a figurehead whenever they need to, to try to make them look like the good guy. Personally Ray Scott has zero credibility with me anymore. All he has proven is he has a price and he has been bought be ESPN.



Im not totally against a dues increase, your right its not a lot of money but unless they can show the members of the federation where that money will go then im not for it. Show me how that money will benefit the federation and its members then my mind can be changed.



Again its not about the money. ESPN/BASS has beee trying to push the Federation around ever since they took over. Its obvious the Federation has tired of it and it taking a long overdue stand. THis is the reason "TBF" was formed, the PAA was formed for the same reasons. THe Pro's are also tireing of BASS's antics. ESPN has ruined BASS and I think thats a shame.

 

[scott lewis]

Can you say FLW, Everstart , BFL.

I hope BASS understands they are not the only game in town anymore.

I agree BASS has changed since ESPN investment.

We must understand that BASS is ran by the corporate mentality (NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT) and driven by other goals than when it was ran by Ray Scott.

Ask your self this, Is the goal of Bass to benefit of the anglers, Sponsors and the future of the sport or is it ran to benefit ESPN.

Of course it is profit driven now. We must understand that and accept it or move on.

 

[Texas Transplant]

I believe that they've already shown 'where' the money goes. However, I also do not believe that any organization has to show where it goes. We have the same problem with the by-laws also. I'm guessing that most clubs do.



Federation anglers, for the most part are Federation anglers. I'm also guessing that most are probably already members of FLW. Does Irwin explain where that money goes?



I also agree that ESPN probably does not really 'get' the whole Federation situation. But again, we must all remember this is not (and will not be) the BASS of the 70's or 80's. Everything changes.



If you haven't read it, get a copy of 'Who moved my cheese'. Yes it's fairly corny, but does make some very good points about 'change'.



Tex

 

[Jim B]

Tex, BASS has absolutly not given an accounting of where that money goes.



Back when the federation members dues system was put in place any monies that were paid into it was to be returned in benefits to the federation as a whole. BASS at that time provided a an outline of where that money was spent. that original dues system was voted on by each state federation. They asked and showd us the benefits and we voted on it as we should. Same went for the $3 increase in the early 90's. They showed us where that money was going and we voted on it



This time around they havent done that. So where is that money going? Nobody but BASS knows and they arent telling anyone. Those who pay that money should be told where that money is going because that money is designed to benefit the anglers. My bet is its just another way to make a profit and that is total BS. Also without giving the federation the chance to vote on it its totally bogus.



Again BASS does not own the federation, or the state federations nor do they govern thier business as much as BASS likes to think they can.



Keep in mind that the Federation dues and BASS mepbership dues are two totally different things. Bass can raise BASS membership dues all they want and not have to tell a soul why, they control that(same goes for Operation Bass dues for FLW). But the federation dues are something that is written in to the federations constutuion that that money is to benefit the anglers and any changes to it are to be voted on. All BASS had to to was show us why the increase was needed and let us vote on it and none of this would ever be happening.



Again i dont feel this is about $5, its about about BASS and that lack of regard for the federations. All they want is money, bottom line. BASS has had a history of trying to push things on the federation and its anglers in an attempt to make money since ESPN took over. First they tried to mandate and control what sponsors the states have to align with BASS( something they cant do) to try to make more money off the sponsors. They wanted the anglers at the nationals to wear only BASS soponors logos so those sponsors would get airtime and get Bass $$$$ without any regard for sponsors that these "grassroots anglers" had and worked hard to get. At one point they wanted to take away the federations classic spots and do away with the whole nationals and divisional system( something our Federation dues pay for). And now this. It dosent sound like a company that really cares about its "grassroots anglers" does it?

 

[Texas Transplant]

It's not the Federation dues that are changing. It's the BASS dues. Federation dues are not changing.

Bass can raise BASS membership dues all they want and not have to tell a soul why, they control that(same goes for Operation Bass dues for FLW).

As always seems to be the case, the 'communication' (both sides understanding what is being communicated, is not always clear. Lot's of speculation.



I made sure that I got the straight skinny from both my District Rep and our Federation Secretary. They have both assured me that only the BASS dues are changing, not the Federation dues.



Tex

 

[Jim B]

Tex, State federation dues are not changing you are right. Its national federation dues that bass wants to up. Again since BASS does not own the federation they cant just up these dues without the consent of the membership period.



If they want to up due BASS membership dues, you know the one that gets you that waste of paper called Bassmaster magazine thats thier right to do so any time.





I get the feeling from reading this thread and other posts about things like the PAA that you tend to side with BASS and thats fine . I see things a little differently. ESPN has totally ruined what was once a great organization. To date hey have most of thier pro's angry with them, they are at odds with the Federation( thier real bread and butter) and none of those relationships seem to have any hops of finding common ground any time soon. BASS has shown zero interest in growing the sport or protecting our right to fish since ESPN took over. All they want now it TV ratings and money and its pretty obvious. I dont see BASS in its current state as being good for our sport long term. They dont care about the sport, they only care about $$$$$.



Personally i hope the Federation stays united and cuts ties with BASS. Wether that means pairing with Jabobs or doing thier own thing would have to be figured out. It would allow me to dump my BASS membership so i wont get that junk mail called Bassmaster and all the other crap they send me.

 

[Texas Transplant]

I think it always causes some amonut of discussion and confusion whenever someone makes changes. Always has, and always will.



You are right in that I tend to support BASS. FLW is fine, but I personally don't like some of the ways they go about their business, but I'm still a member.



The PAA is simply a joke. Was before. Is now. Irwin killed it with the new tour he announced, they just haven't had the funeral as yet.



BASS (and certainly Ray Scott) grew the sport to what it is. Somebody else will likely grow it bigger. Irwin is certainly to be credited for his share of helping the sport grow. Will BASS/ESPN hit some bumps in the road. Yes.



And whenever Irwin makes changes (which he will at some point), the gnawing and gnashing of teeth will be heard on that front. Right now, his model is still the same as it's been for awhile.



As someone else put (Trump), that's why they have menu's in resturants. Different choices

Tex

 

[Jim B]

Can i ask why you think the PAA is a joke? My view on that is it was formed by the pro anglers for many of the same reasons TBF was formed by the state federations. They wanted a unified voice and now they have it. The guys that formed the PAA ( VanDam, Woo, etc) are no joke for sure. They are the top names in the sport. I dont think BASS has figured it out yet but they will, without those top name guys( they will loose them if they contunue down the current path) and the federations( same deal) they are finished.



You are right. The BASS Ray Scott built is what got the sport to where it is today. But The current BASS is not the BASS that Ray Scott built. ESPN took BASS and madwe a joke out of it. Look at Bassmaster Mag, once the premier magazine in al of bass fishing. Now its 70% adds and the articles are just reprints of past articles slightly updated. Im sure if i went back to soem of my old mags i could find articles reprinted word for word in a newer one. There is no new info anymore, but buy are there some ads for stuff i will never buy. They are screwing it up pretty bad on all points in the name of making as much profit as possible.

 

[Texas Transplant]

On the PAA being a joke.



Name anything they have been able to accomplish, other than create/update a web site?



I would agree with you that the leadership of the PAA are certainly key figures and good businessmen. But, the PAA is effectively a 'union' or attempting to be. They are all independent businessmen, that are not going to put up their money (other than maybe some small 'seed money') to set up their own trail.



Neither the FLW Tour (Irwin Jacobs) or ESPN/BASS has any incentive to deal with them. And the major advertisers/manufacturers are going to spend money where there is no discernable return (advertising/media/etc.).



Tex